New with questions

[MNP]

Hi everyone!
I have been reading your posts for over a year and I am so thankful for everyone who posts! You guys have helped me so much!

I was diagnosed in 2018 and it seems that my flares are getting more frequent and sometimes more intense. I take Cymbalta and a prescribed potassium supplement because I am low due to IBS-d.

I wanted to ask a few questions and see what you guys think.
First, has anyone experienced that their fibro symptoms started several areas but then spread to new areas over time(without the old spots going away). I am asking because my initial symptoms were more lower back then moved to include legs and feet ….then upper back and now my neck. And occasionally the all over ache appears.

Also, it is confusing sometimes because I know I have arthritis in my neck and back and
so am not always sure what issue is causing my symptoms. So I was wondering if others who have arthritis could explain how they know the difference between their fibro pain and arthritis pain. My docs say it could be either /both and of course I know my anxiety makes my symptoms worse!

Again, thanks to you all! You guys are angels in my life!

 

[MNP]

Hi everyone!
I have been reading your posts for over a year and I am so thankful for everyone who posts! You guys have helped me so much!

I was diagnosed in 2018 and it seems that my flares are getting more frequent and sometimes more intense. I take Cymbalta and a prescribed potassium supplement because I am low due to IBS-d.

I wanted to ask a few questions and see what you guys think.
First, has anyone experienced that their fibro symptoms started several areas but then spread to new areas over time(without the old spots going away). I am asking because my initial symptoms were more lower back then moved to include legs and feet ….then upper back and now my neck. And occasionally the all over ache appears.

Also, it is confusing sometimes because I know I have arthritis in my neck and back and
so am not always sure what issue is causing my symptoms. So I was wondering if others who have arthritis could explain how they know the difference between their fibro pain and arthritis pain. My docs say it could be either /both and of course I know my anxiety makes my symptoms worse!

Again, thanks to you all! You guys are angels in my life!

Forgot to list my symptoms!

Pain/tight muscle feeling/buzzing/ sometimes burning/shooting pain—-in legs, upper and lower back, feet, neck, scalp, butt
#not all at the same time or every day

Bruise easily
Recent positive ANA- need to follow up

 

[sunkacola]

Greetings, MNP.
It is not uncommon for symptoms to start in one area or a few areas and then show up in others in addition.

As for whether some specific pain is caused by arthritis or by fibromyalgia, when you have both.....?
I am wondering why it even matters to you. I don't think there's any definitive way to determine which thing is causing a certain pain if y ou know that you have both conditions, and I can't think of any reason it would matter to figure it out even if you could. The same things will always either help or cause more pain or be neutral, no matter what is causing it, and you of course need to find out what those things are for yourself (as i am sure you have been doing).

Bruising easily is not a common fibromyalgia symptoms so you may think about having that specific thing addressed by a doctor if you have not already done so.

Your other symptoms as listed are all commonly found in people with fibro.
I don't know what ANA is, so can't reply to that.

Welcome to the forum. I hope we can be helpful to you and supportive. that's what we are here for.

 

[MNP]

Thanks for replying Sunkacola!

Sorry! ANA stands for anti nuclear antibody…it is a blood test result that sometimes can reflect an autoimmune issue.

I guess the reason I was asking the question about symptoms of arthritis vs fibro because I thought if I knew which symptoms belonged to which diagnosis…it would help be choose treatment modalities. But like you said things either work, or don’t work no matter what my diagnosis is…

Thanks again!

 

[cookiebaker]

Hi @MNP - I also have both arthritis - in lower back and neck - and fibro... and to be perfectly honest, it is really hard to tell them apart.

For me - my fibro presents more as muscle & tendon pain & tenderness - like a bruised feeling - all over.. I also get bouts of what seems to be tendonitis in various areas, but it tends to go away far too quickly for it to be real tendonitis.

my neck arthritis (severe to very severe in a couple of places) tends to present more as nerve related problems - numbness, tingling, random sharp stabbing pains across the shoulders & down the arms to the hands (also have arthritis in the hands compounding problems there)
I also have a near constant headache related to the neck arthritis as well.
My lower back and SI joints are another problem area for me.. the right SI is pretty bad these days, but i am reasonable sure the pain in my hip area is caused by that joint, as I can follow the bruised, sore muscle feeling all the way from the hip area back to the SI joint where it seems to originate from.

in the case of arthritis, what you actual feel is going to depend a lot on the severity of the arthritis - mild to moderate probably wont cause as many problems as severe to very severe. Not saying you wont feel anything - but it may be less arthritis and more fibro related if the arthritis is not that bad.
Either way.. pain is pain, so doing what ever you can to reduce that pain is going to be of benefit. Muscle tension can in fact cause similar nerve related problems to what arthritis does, so doing what you can to de-stress and try to relax tense muscles should help with that type of pain. heating pad, massage, hot shower or bath..

As for the ANA - depends on the actual ratio - I also had a positive ANA, but a low ratio - 1:80, which i was informed is not all that uncommon as we get older... if it was higher, then they would be more interested in pursuing further.

from Healthline...

 

[MNP]

Dear cookiebaker,
Thanks so much for your reply!
I am really not sure how bad my arthritis is in both areas…I think worse in my neck. The x ray report on my neck said moderate disk degeneration in one area…arthritis throughout….bone spurs somewhere.
I never have had much neck pain except in the last year and a half (after a crazy hard bike ride that was supposed to be easy).
Anyway…so I had neck pain the next day after the ride which triggered anxiety about it! Ugh! Sooooo….whenever I get neck pain now my anxiety flares too!

I did some research on arthritis of the neck and spine….it is very common in people my age and older!(I’ll be 59 in April). For some reason the fact that it is so common was comforting.

I had an mri of my lower back 5 years ago and although there was a disk bulge and a protrusion…and some arthritis the ortho said nothing was pressing on my spinal cord or nerve roots in that area. Overall he said my lower back was good for my age.

I totally understand the tendonitis feeling you describe. The sharp stabbing and tingly sensations for me are usually from the waist down which could be from tight muscles since my anxiety cause lots of tight muscles everywhere!

So anyway….sometimes I don’t feel like I am sure of anything re: fibro/arthritis/anxiety as causes of my pain…but this forum and your response has helped me a lot and I am thankful for that!

Take care!

 

[MNP]

Ohhhhh!
One last thing…I researched the accuracy of x-rays and MRI’s in detecting spinal issues…kind of interesting….there can be great variability in what each radiologist “finds” even when they look at the same scan. Not sure if this is comforting or not…just thinking and praying that maybe your neck arthritis isn’t severe just because one scan said that it was

 

[JayCS]

So I was wondering if others who have arthritis could explain how they know the difference between their fibro pain and arthritis pain. My docs say it could be either /bot

Hi MNP... I have no arthritis, but various pain issues and other symptoms with overlapping causes. My experience is that it is difficult, but it makes a lot of difference to learn to distinguish overlapping causes.
I take great care to analyze and may get on others' nerves by doing so at length, but it is this that has helped me bring my local pains down to almost zero. I wasn't alone doing so, my acupressurist and my osteopaths shared this attitude, but they knew they could only give ideas/pointers, and support me finding out what is what.
Not able to give ideas about arthritis pain, I can just suggest to sense, describe and analyze the pain types like you already do, then watch triggers & treatments closely and how they compare with various pain types. I use mainly exercises, stretches, acupressure and a massager, but also heat or cold and a whole lot of other things for local pains. These can sometimes can help, sometimes harm, and this in my experience depends on what the cause is. People who can't sense any difference will feel powerless and will generalize, saying it isn't possible to find a difference. Even in cases where this is true, it's possible to make experienced guesses and make sure we don't fire too much of something at it which might harm. That generalized might mean for people who can't sense differences to be careful: low & slow - but this may then take a long time to get a pain down, meaning others can come up in the meantime, causing overlaps and complicating everything. Whilst I in 90% of cases know what something has been caused by and get it down quickly inside of a few minutes or hours to prevent overlaps. Means keeping on my toes & high self-care, but is fun and self-empowering.

So I very much understand and support your question.

And my suggestion for arthritis pain vs. fibro pain is that arthritis pain will(?) be more in the joints themselves, whilst fibro only seems to be there, but is actually a pain in the ends of the tendons above and below joints.
Without having (much) arthritis I can sense the difference by moving the limbs etc. concerned by itself in a different way to normal, then by using another limb, e.g. move a finger with the fingers of my other hand, or if that's too confusing the whole other hand, then by feeling and very slightly pressing all around that joint to feel where pain or swelling or something else seems to get worse or even "originate" from.
If this doesn't fit for you then it might still give you ideas to "sense" into your body more closely.

These are things that definitely doctors, but also even the most sensitive practitioners cannot answer for us, because they would need to feel something that is there in ours, with parts their own body. But often there is nothing to feel from the outside, it is our very own subjective pain sensation that can tell the difference and which can then point to various ways of treating it, which is something we can test and note what is best for what. Sensitive practitioners can interact from their experience with what we can tell them. But their sensitivity derives from their own bodies, not ours.

 

[MNP]

Thanks so much JayCS!
You are always so kind and thorough in your responses to everyone! My goal is to be as methodical as you are in finding supplements and therapies that work for me as well as they do for you!

One thing that holds me back from trying different therapies is a fear that I will make something worse …but as you say… low and slow might help with that.

Several people on this forum have talked about getting to the point of not fearing their pain anymore. I’d really like to get to that point because I think that would make a huge difference in what treatments I might try.

Thanks again for replying to me and for always sharing your many ideas, thoughts and strategies for coping.

 

[cookiebaker]

Ohhhhh!
One last thing…I researched the accuracy of x-rays and MRI’s in detecting spinal issues…kind of interesting….there can be great variability in what each radiologist “finds” even when they look at the same scan. Not sure if this is comforting or not…just thinking and praying that maybe your neck arthritis isn’t severe just because one scan said that it was

yeah i am also aware of the differences between who reads the images...
in fact, i am going to another clinic - orthopedic specialty clinic - very soon for a second opinion about things.

But, the big thing to remember is that stressing about it will most likely make things feel worse. i know it is easier said than done, but trying to keep the stress and anxiety down is a big factor.

 

[sweetkamie20]

...it seems that my flares are getting more frequent and sometimes more intense...

. I'm on that trip with you but I've managed to get a grip. Thank God!

First, has anyone experienced that their fibro symptoms started several areas but then spread to new areas over time(without the old spots going away).

Yes, indeed. From feeling like there's lead in my veins for about 10 years to burning in my upper back, neck and head. The change was sort of sudden and occurred about 9 years after onset.

I am asking because my initial symptoms were more lower back then moved to include legs and feet ….then upper back and now my neck. And occasionally the all over ache appears.

Now I tend to get a more serious version of the burning and a milder form of the lead in veins...

Also, it is confusing sometimes because I know I have arthritis in my neck and back and so am not always sure what issue is causing my symptoms. So I was wondering if others who have arthritis could explain how they know the difference between their fibro pain and arthritis pain.

Hmmm...I have arthritis from sports and the pain I get is triggered by weather - when it's going to rain or the outside temp is getting cold. Maybe that's something that can provide clues - does one type of pain show up when the weather is changing?

Again, thanks to you all! You guys are angels in my life!

Takes an angel to know one

 

[seniorzala]

if you have a High CRP level in your Blood ,it indicates some kind inlammation It can also be RA.
A lot syndromes overlap ,so it's had to Diagnose.
senior

 

[JayCS]

Thank you!

a fear that I will make something worse … Several people ... have talked about getting to the point of not fearing their pain anymore. I’d really like to get to that point because I think that would make a huge difference in what treatments I might try.

Easily said and wished for, isn't it... * sigh *
I spose in life generally we'd do ourselves a favour by concentrating on the Present
instead of letting films of the Past and Future dictate and fog over what is simply to be done.
One strategy is working on "letting go" the fears and turmoil about past events and of possible future events.
But working on the negative, the problems, is maybe less than half, cos it often complicates things further.
So if possible, stepping aside from these inner arrows, which sometimes seem outside, can simplify that.
Increasing mindfulness of the Here and Now leaves less and less room to even perceive the arrows.
Placing ourselves in the Now can take us out of their way, whether by them fading away or gliding off us.
Personally, I find if I "go into" fear pain and body pain themselves whilst using intense relaxation exercises,
a great deal of them dissolves by them losing their scariness, their threat, but often grow from distraction.
Every single second I am able to (and remember ), to do this brings me forward.
Acceptance and commitment therapy, ACT, is probably one of the best mind-frameworks to practice it.

 

[MNP]

I am glad you are getting another opinion! I know it may sound weird…but when a doctor seems more positive about a condition and says something like “oh…that isn’t too bad” or “ we can treat that” it seems to help mentally

Yes! I totally agree with your comment about stress! That is a big challenge for me! I really do not want to use another medication for anxiety besides the cymbalta that I take…so I try breathing…camomile tea…cbd oil….walking(sometimes) and prayer and I just started a few free mindfulness podcasts. I also have a medical marijuana license but haven’t been to the dispensary yet.

Thanks again for all your posts and for replying to me!

 

[MNP]

Dear sweetkamie20,
Thanks so much for your reply! I find it can be pretty frustrating when symptoms change to figure out what the heck is going on and then to figure out how to deal with it!

When you said you are getting a grip now…are there specific strategies that have helped you(if you want to share them)?
Thanks so much!